Wednesday, December 03, 2008

How Can You Ignore This Evidence?

Dr. Ron Polarik offers his most compelling analysis to date on why the certificate of live birth Barack Obama produced as evidence of his birth in Hawaii is a forged document, which I urge all skeptics to click here to read. After you skeptics get through reading Polarik's analysis, please come back and tell me specifically what is wrong with his analysis, particularly the local Democratic attorney who says she has taken a course to be trained on detecting forged documents. Does the fact that Obama's COLB is a forgery prove he is not a natural born citizen? No. Should the fact that a candidate for president of the U.S. would offer a forged document as proof of his natural born status disqualify him from holding office? Absolutely. It is, after all, a federal crime.


Anonymous said...

The burden of PROOF is generally on the party making the accusation.

If someone accused me of not being an American citizen, I'm not under any obligation to prove them wrong.

That's all I see in this exercise of mental masturbation that the Republican far right keeps pushing...."You know what you did and it's on you to prove our baseless allegations wrong"

They're sore losers, a whining minority that is desperately trying to keep him from taking the office he was voted into, and they'll say or do anything to those ends.

They're not going to stop their slander and lies once he takes office either, I'd imagine, and by responding to them now, he'd just be signaling that there was something, anything, to their argument, which is exactly what they want to goad him into doing.

Here's how I see it going down:

The court will vote not to consider it, because it is baseless and they would almost certainly start a riot.

After the court throws it out, the idiots will make death threats against the electors and such to try and force them to vote John McCain, that won't work either because they'd have t convince 97 members of the Democratic Party to make a faithless vote for John McCain.

Basically, Barack Obama is our president now, you guys can "shut up and respect him" just like we were told to do with Dubya, I know there are radicals on both sides that would never stop, but the electorate has spoken, and all you can really do is wait til 2012 and vote again.

Anonymous said...

Oh, and you never did tell me how Bobby Jindal is supposed to run in 2012 since both of his parents were immigrants.

(Not that this would stop him, but you seem to think that having an immigrant parent is disqualification.)

Gary R. Welsh said...

I didn't think you would actually read Polarik's analysis and tell us what's wrong with it.

Anonymous said...

I don't see any evidence, it all appears to be circumstantial crap that hasn't actually been researched, based on laws that aren't even in effect anymore, depending on the supposition that Mr. Obama was born in Kenya, which is based on an alleged phone call that he doesn't even have a recording or transcript of.

Unless you have something concrete, and I mean a damned smoking gun that would be reasonable evidence of your claim that he was born in Kenya (of which nothing at this point seems to prove that he was born anywhere other than Honolulu, Hawaii), I have to believe this is some kind of right wing last ditch effort to spread Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt, so as to try to keep him from taking the white house, because they are sore that they lost an election with a margin of at least 8 million votes and 97 electoral votes.

What was the best that Dubya ever did?

3 million popular and 16 electoral?

First time he lost by over half a million popular and won by 1 electoral?

I think it's just Republican bitterness that they haven't been popular since Ronald Reagan, and the best they ever managed in the last 16 years was a controversial election followed by another marginal re-election.

This is a Center-Left country, the Republicans have had to use Karl Rove style scare tactics to get any kind of turnout, sending scary mailers to Jews and making millions of Robocalls telling people Obama worked closely with a highly respected college professor on a commission they were both appointed to by Ronald Reagan, oh I'm sorry, "domestic terrorist"

Concerned Taxpayer said...

So..."because it would almost certainly start a riot" we should just IGNORE the laws of the land and the United States Constitution?
Typical liberal drivel.

Bottom line. Why doesn't "The One" just show us his birth certificate and end this? I thought he was supposed to be "healing" the country.

So he will sit down with known terrorists and murderers with no pre-conditions, but he WON'T just show us his REAL birth certificate.

M Theory said...

Gary, I posted that analysis a few days back and the only responses I saw were accusations that I am anti-semitic and threats to report me to the anti-defamation league.

Anonymous said...

If there was any merit to your trumped up case, wouldn't the NSA, FBI, CIA, or the multi billion dollar Homeland Security Bureaucracy that King George, your hero, gave record funding to and/or created have found that out while vetting him.

I mean we're not talking about the kind of "illegal immigrant" the Republicans want here, scrubbing toilets for $1 an hour......

artfuggins said...

I hope we are not looking at 8 years of listening to this baseless drivel. Our country is in a crisis and everyone needs to be working to recover from the Bush/Cheney mess.

IndyPaul said...

These claims of Polarik's have been debunked some time ago, yet he raises the same arguments here. See Its like Palin's continuing to claim that she said 'thanks but no thanks' on the bridge to nowhere long after the claim had been shown to be false. His logic is hilarious - when confronted with the digital photos of the document, in contradiction to his earlier conclusion that there was none, he decides the only answer is that it is a fake as well.

Much of this 'analysis' is pure speculation, such as his imagining of how a COLB is produced. Nor have I ever seen any evidence to back up the dismissal of Factcheck and its creator the Annenberg Foundation as just some kind of wing of the Obama campaign, when the Annenbergs were both ambassadors under Republican presidents (Nixon and Reagan), and the president and chairwoman of the foundation, Leonore Annenberg, born in 1918, endorsed John McCain in the 2008 presidential election. Just an example of the facts Polarnik does not bother with in his 'research'.

jbargeusa said...

I'm willing to keep an open mind on this - I can contemplate a conspircy theory or two.
But I do have to point out that if Obama produced his original birth certificate and it was problem-free, people would just say it was phony.
So why bother - wrestle with a pig and you get dirty and the pig likes it.
In a nutshell, the head of the Hawaiin Health Department has said it is legitimate.
The end.
(For all practical purposes - I'm sure it will rage on and on and on in cyberspace.)

jbargeusa said...

"Although the exact process for how these COLB forms are completed is not known, I imagine that...."
Okay, he's got an imagination.
Good for him.
"Logic dictates, however, that if birth record confirmed that Obama was born in Honolulu, the Department of Health would have thrown a huge luau in his honor by now."
"My bet would be that the completion of the COLB is not an automated process."
Uh, if not?
"it is worth noting that, by entering information into this request form, you are also replicating what a staff person might do to create the COLB itself."
Might, just might. Or not. Who knows?
"You cannot save this form with the information entered, and I would imagine that the same is true for the COLB form."
Gosh, this guy's got a great imagination.
"I believe that the online COLB form is completed in much the same way."
Clap your hands - Tinkerbelle's gonna live!
"Since all COLBs are printed on the very same device" - Oh yes, of course, sure, the very same device, absolutely, keep going, I'm enthralled!
"Essentially, the red flags for me were the predominance of white and gray pixels in between the letters of the CHILD'S NAME."
In all honesty, trying to read this guy is like tring to swim in pudding.
But he makes an awful big deal that CHILD'S NAME has been tampered with on the COLB.
But he never says why they would need to change those particular words.
I had to quit - maybe there is really something amazing that the guy offers.
But I get a lot of theories presented as facts and then a lot of technical talk that I'm simply not qualified to pass judgement on.
I'm guessing it is a bunch of hooey.
Obama was born in Hawaii, they did the birth certificate there, the end.

Concerned Taxpayer said...

"I hope we are not looking at 8 years of listening to this baseless drivel. Our country is in a crisis and everyone needs to be working to recover from the Bush/Cheney mess."
Well, then, artfuggins...what is your excuse for him not just showing us his REAL birth certificate. What is he afraid of?

jbargeusa said...

As near as I can tell (thinking that he isn't covering up his birth in Kenya) he thinks that producing yet another document won't satisfy the nay sayers ("Obama produced a forged long birth certificate form - I can tell from the type font used!").
The head of the Health Department has confirmed it is a legit birth certificate on file.
Game, set, and match.
I would continue reviewing the article linked but yowsa it's a long one to go through.

Gary R. Welsh said...

Just what I thought. Not a single one of you naysayers can refute Polarik's anlaysis. Obama has proven many times over Barnum's theory that a fool is born every minute. An absolutely uneducated, uninformed population makes it possible to pull off the biggest fraud in American political history.

IndyPaul said...

Gary - I challange you to read the refutation of Polarik's 'analysis', as you have challanged us to read that 'analysis', and respond accordingly.

Gary R. Welsh said...

IndyPaul, I've read what this AJ Strata guy has written. First of all, most of his analysis was based on other so-called experts who were posting analysis on the Internet to cloud the issues Polarik was raising. Even Polarik discredits those other expert analysis. In the comments to his post, whenever anyone raises a legitimate point in his logic, he simply responds with a snarky non-responsive comment. He doesn't even approach the detail of Polarik's analysis. He was paid, no doubtedly, by Obama's $600 million campaign to obfuscate--hey, look over here--don't look there. They became quite good at that by the end of the campaign. How else do you get the press to completely ignore the $115,000 bribe Obama accepted as a state senator and the $300,000 kickback he got from Rezko to purchase his home.

IndyPaul said...

Who is clouding the issues Polarik is raising? Strata addresses them each clearly and without Polarik's 'imagination' (detailed by jbarg above). Polarik does not address the substance of Starta's rebuttal, made nearly 5 months ago. Nor is Polarik correct about Factcheck, run by Annenberg, whose president endorsed McCain.

A cursory review of Strata's site reveals that he is no fan of Obama - he defends Palin and is critical of Valerie Plame, Kerry, and the alleged Downing Street memo. Yet he is also willing to point out the silliness of these forgery claims as "people making wild claims, being proved wrong, and then moving onto new wild claims - to be proved wrong again." Sounds familiar.

varangianguard said...

C'mon, Gary. This "Polarik" person (whomever that might be) launched into a technical recitation of PhotoShop capabilities. Even if it really had any credibility, he lost it for the following reasons.

1) The arguments were somewhat circular in fashion. If one "could" use Photoshop, then Photoshop "must" have been used, for example.

2) Too much detail (which may be a result of originally providing too little). Still, it made my eyes glaze over. Repeatedly.

3) No corroboration from other Photoshop geeks. Remember Rathergate? Other geeks came out of the woodwork to bolster the opinion that the document was faked.

Number three is the killer in my opinion. If there was really anything to this, somebody (anybody) else would jump at the chance for their fifteen minutes and corroborate this. Hasn't happened. Crickets chirping.

Sorry, but until there is a lot of buzz from others, this is just another crank call.

garyj said...

I hope we are not looking at 8 years of listening to this baseless drivel

Whats makes you so sure B. Hussein bin-Laden Obama will be there for 8 years. Presidents are elected for 4 year terms.

Gary R. Welsh said...

And the Ocscar goes to:

- Best Actor--Barack Obama
- Best Supporting Actor--US Media
- Best Movie--The Making of Barack Obama
- Best Director--David Axelrod
- Best Producer--George Soros

Bill Clinton was right. Barack Obama is nothing but a fairy tale.

jbargeusa said...

Well, I didn't refute the analysis of pixels because I'm not technically competent to do so.
I didn't go through the rest of the article, because, quite frankly, I have a life.
But I do refute the logic: "Let's change the words CHILD'S NAME, so that it says...CHILD'S NAME".
What benefit is there to do so?
As for why there are issues that the guy raises who can say.
But since he uses such terrible logic through out his article (as I repeatedly pointed out already), it is believable (to me) that he is trying to fool you, much as you think Barack is trying to fool us.
Besides the head of the Hawaiin Health Department has confirmed it is a legit birth certificate.
We can come up with convoluted reasons that she did so but I just have the sneaking suspicion, that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii, they filled out the birth certificate correctly, and we're done.
But I am glad the right spends time on this instead of plotting to blunt the liberal agenda.

Gary R. Welsh said...

For the last damn time, Hawaii never confirmed that the COLB posted on the Internet by Obama's campaign is genuine. The state only confirmed it had a birth recorded for him in its records. As I've stated on numerous occasions, the Hawaiian law at the time was flawed for purposes of ensuring that only people born in Hawaii could register a birth there. The law, on its face, allowed parents to record births which never occurred in Hawaii.

jbargeusa said...

Okay, the state of Hawaii has not said that the image posted on a website is genuine.
From the KS Star today:
"As today's Page A-1 story demonstrates, there's no credible evidence to suggest the document is phony. Reporters from have examined the document and posted photos proving it has the raised seal critics claim is missing. The State of Hawaii has also authenticated it. There was a contemporaneous birth announcement in a Hawaii newspaper."
Hmmmm........2 versions of reality are floating around here.
Is is the sinister one of a birth in Kenya (did the mother have a passport? Wouldn't there be proof of travel there? I don't honestly know...) and thus a conspiracy, or is it the mundane one that is true?
Clearly I plunk down for the mundane one.
If I had nothing but free time I would gladly research it - believe it or not, I am not afraid of the truth.
You know what? If Obama was born in Kenya the nation would still perservere.
So again, I can contemplate a conspiracy theory to two.
But I don't believe in jumping to conclusions from an internet article from an individual whom I proved to used theories and then consider them as facts.
And no one has explained to me why they would need to fake CHILD'S NAME to make it read CHILD'S NAME.
Sure, possibly he was born in Kenya, and then they circumvented the controls in place to fake a birth place.
Though it seems to me if they did that they wouldn't need to fake the COLB.....but there is probably some convuluted reason (the original certificate states Kenya, maybe?)
Again, I can contemplate all of this, and I will go where the evidence leads.
But so far there's not enough to make me ditch the simple answer for the complicated one.

M Theory said...

Art, did it ever occur to you that our country is IN a crisis because our politicians often break the law and put their own selfish interests ahead of ours?